fingerpicking scales

[robithinker]

I'm a beginner and have a decent working knowledge of scales from my saxophone playing days. How do you properly fingerpick scales? I want to build a solid foundation with learning all the scales but don't want to be stuck doing it all with my thumb if this is the wrong method.

Thanks,
Robi

[NGiorgio]

You definitely do not want to do scales with the thumb. Scales should be played with alternating fingers, such as im, ia, ma etc. If you are pursuing Classical technique try Segovia,'s diatonic major and minor scales. Whatever you do stay with strict alternate fingering even when going from one string to another. The scales should also be played with rest strokes, not free strokes.

[Jon Carter]

Scales should be practiced with alternating fingers using rest stroke (apoyando/picado) im, ia, ma.

Scales should also be practiced using free stroke (tirando), especially tremolo scales - ima, ami. One stroke for each note, or three strokes per note.

And also using a combination of free stroke & rest stroke - free stroke one string, rest on the next, or free stroke one note, rest on the next.

Try ligado (slur) scales.

And don't give up those thumb scales. Again use apoyando and tirando and combinations.

Go for total control and finger/thumb awareness, and if you can think of any other way of doing scales, do it. Try pi

You will reap the rewards

[NGiorgio]

All good points. A bit heavy though, for a beginner don't you think? I was just trying to keep it simple. We don't want Robi going back to the Saxophone, do we?

[Jon Carter]

NGiorgio, you have obviously been taught differently from myself. But of course the way one is taught depends very much on the individual and the teacher. Different strokes for different folks.

From my experience, one shouldn't be told early on "You definitely do not want to do scales with the thumb" and "The scales should also be played with rest strokes, not free strokes" - this creates boundaries for the player both physically and mentally.

If one can encompass as many techniques as possible from the beginning, then their playing will evolve more naturally and much faster. For example, playing scales tirando, in particular with a-m alternation, will be highly beneficial for tremolo string crossing.

Why just play scales for the sake of learning scales and the rest stroke, when you can be actively preparing yourself for so much more.

Economy of motion and economy of time are two of the most important principles for a guitarist.

And for a flamenco guitarist to advise another (potential flamenco) guitarist to not do scales with the thumb??

[NGiorgio]

Jon, you are right. I should have said, start with rest stroke scales before doing other variations. In Segovia's book of scales, he suggests repetitions in apoyando. That book was my beginning with scales. In the introduction, Segovia's last sentence, " The practice of scales enables one to solve a greater number of technical problems in a shorter time than the study of any other excercise." That says it all.

I agree that we all can benefit from playing scales. Your points are well taken. I intend to try some of the variations you have mentioned.

[Jonny Hotnuts]

I was going to add my 2 cents, but Jon Carter summed up everything I was going to say.

I have found there are songs with scales that work better using the thumb and some that work better using alt finger picking.

My advice is learn both.

Take them slow at first making them perfect with sound and execution.
Build speed with time.

Maybe try the scales in thirds if you get board.

-JH

[robithinker]

Thank you very much for the feedback. Anyone have any good web-sites that can help with rest stroke, or maybe some book suggestions.

[Jon Carter]

NGiorgo, you are also right, in that the majority of scale runs are executed using i-m rest stroke alternations, especially in classical guitar playing.

However, I have met many restrictive teachers, who have never achieved their personal ambitions musically and therefore turn their aspirations towards financial gain in retribution for the hours they have spent pursuing their goal - unsuccessfully. And therefore they intend to put their students through as many hours as posssible to line their pockets.

Your best teacher is yourself. Don't let anyone dictate to you anything that you feel is beneath your capabilities. Your teacher should recognise your capabilities, and enhance them.

[NGiorgio]

Try Mel Bay Publications web site. They have books on Fingerstyle, Classical or Flamenco. Assuming that you can read music, any Classical method book should start you off in the right direction. Good Luck.

[Jonny Hotnuts]

Again I commend Jons insight.

If Segovia listened to what everyone told him the guitar would still be a parlor instrument.