Manuel Rodriguez Guitars? [Archive] - Guitar Salon International Forums

Nausicaa

11-26-2003, 05:38 PM

Hi again. Still shopping. I came across some nice looking Manuel Rodriguez guitars at a local music store earlier today. I played around on them and they sounded pretty nice. As I said in another thread though, I'm rather inexperienced with the sounds of classical guitars and differentiating between a "good" guitar from a "bad" one. I also can't trust the salesman as he tries to sell this one of these to me because it is the only brand of classical they stock, and I have nothing to compare them to. I have been looking for some professional reviews and opinions regarding Rodriguez guitars (C3 mostly), and I can't seem to find any! Also, you here at GSI don't seem to sell them. This has concerned me a little bit. They have a flashy website, and the guitars appear to be VERY handmade (including a signature on guitars priced less than $600, which surprised me!).

Does anyone know anything about this manufacturer? Why aren't they sold here at GSI? Are they of lesser quality than other midrange guitars such as Alhambra or Cordoba?

Any help would, again, be very much appreciated.

Thanks!

PS: I might also add that these guitars were extremely attractive. Canadian Cedar tops with Indian Rosewood siding, and a high gloss finish. The rosettes were beautiful as well. I was seduced by their appearance immediately, but I would need opinions on the sound.

MegaBrawn

11-26-2003, 06:21 PM

I have tried a few Manuel Rodriguezs. I did not like them at all. I found them to be incredible mild for a supposedly spanish made guitar.

I'd take an Alhambra or Cordoba over a Manuel Rodriguez any day. So what if it's signed? He'snot a very well-renowned luthier. Besides, no one cares if your guitar is signed as long as it sounds good.

But that's just my opinion. :D

Rex

11-26-2003, 06:55 PM

I just bought one a few weeks ago and am very happy with my purchase. Mine was made in Madrid and they are imported here by Fender. I purchased mine from a shop in St. Louis that normally has around 20 classicals in stock going all the way up to $5000. The Manuel Rodriguez sounded better than the other guitars in it's price range (under $600). In fact, I think it sounded better than most of their $1200 guitars. I had the salesman play it also so I could listen from a distance. It was new in the shop and had new D'Addario composits on it so that may be why it sounded so good in comparision. The salesman said it was comperable to two other brands of student guitar that they already carried so they had no plans to carry the Rodriguez. Their district rep had dropped it off on his last visit, sort of a sample. Mine is weird. The web site says they have Canadian cedar solid tops and rosewood sides and back and even my receipt says that also, but mine actually has a solid Canadian cedar top and walnut sides and back, bookmatched with wooden binding. I think it looks cool. All in all a fine student grade guitar. Of course I have sampled only one and maybe I just got the right one. Mine is loud and the trebles sound good all the way up the neck. The saleman said if you put the same strings that my guitar came with on the $5000 Rameriz they had there that the G string would resonate like crazy. I don't know what my guitar would sound like with plan old D'Addario Pro Artes on it. I have just normal gauge composits and it plays very easy and loud without buzzes.

Nausicaa

11-26-2003, 07:20 PM

Thanks for the replies. Interesting, two conflicting opinions.

Anyone else? :?

Right now, I don't know what to do.

Out of curiosity, Rex, which model did you get? The C1? C3? Also, what models from Cordoba or Alhambra would you recommend MegaBrawn?

Rex

11-26-2003, 07:54 PM

C-1. I'm no expert but I do listen to various cds by various players and know what sound I like. I played steel string guitar for 25 years, fiddle for 3 years, mandolin for 12 and nylon for the last two. I have given up all steel string instruments and just have my two nylon string guitars. I'm not a classical purist, I play a variety of music, including classical, on nylon strings. My lack of focus may account for my taste. :)

MegaBrawn

11-26-2003, 11:28 PM

It's always interesting to hear a conflicting opinion. Just out of curiosity, what other brands in that price range did you try Rex?

Fender is the distributor for Rodriguez's guitar. I have tried tons of Rodriguezs up to the price of $3000. I did not like most of them. I felt for some of their mid range models, they were struggling to keep up with say, a Bernabe of the same price.

I absolutely hated their entry line and lower range models. But keep in mind different people have different ears. What I like doesn't matter, as long as you like it you're happy, everything's swell. Unfortunately, I have not had the please of trying as many Cordobas as I have Alhambras.

What model do I reccommend?I reccommend you buy whatever you can afford. There's no point in me reccommending the high end if you can't afford it and the low end if you are willing to pay more. Just buy the best model you can afford. But more importantly, try it first. A common mistake I find alot of beginners making, is that they are too hasty in purchasing a new guitar. I highly advise you to consult the GSI staff. As much as I know about guitars, and as much as I have been playing, I don't sell guitars for a living. I know what I like, but I don't know what you like.

I have been playing classical guitar for 4 years and have completed my Yamaha Grade 6, which is Yamaha's highest student grade. I have taught privately for a short period of time and am currently the Vice-President and Head Instructor of Ngee Ann Polytechnic Strings.

ferraby

11-27-2003, 05:12 AM

Hi there,

I happen to know a lot about Rodriguez guitars...so here goes.
First of all,i have a 2001 Rodriguez model B spruce top.Overall...i think Rodriguez are really nice guitars....their sound is top class...no kidding.U get what u paid for.Having said that, i have tried both C-1 and C-3 and i am not particularly impressed with them.So judging purely from Alhambra's reputation (haven't tried any)....in that price bracket..u r probably better of with an Alhambra.Not to say that Rodriguez r not famous guitar...no...they r big.From my point of view...Rodriguez r more well known for their concert class guitars...more exclusive and Alhambra r more well known for their entry level.

Now...all rodriguez guitars come with a label mith Manuel Rodriguez's signature on it BUT...those r not his actual signature..its a printed version.So nothing special there.
Regarding whether they r handmade...hmmm...i don't thinks so..definitely not for C-1 and C-3.Even their top ends like Model E (i have tried one...amazing guitar both visually and soundwise) r only 80% hand made and i know this because i talked to one of the staff in their shop in Madrid.

Personally...i think sound wise...or quality wise......you would never go wrong with a Rodriguez guitar if thats what prefer BUT...one thing i sort of realize about rodriguez guitars are....their finish r not very nicely done...usually some flaws here and there (maybe because i am just too picky).So if u r getting a C-3...check the guitar carefully.

sseow

11-27-2003, 05:55 AM

many people mistaken the 2 rodriguez... this manuel rodriguez is a common mass produce guitar found in most guitar store... only very selcted model are handmade and u don't find them in the normal store.... the signatuire is printed so no value...
sound quality no comment...
i have seen the pictures of their factory.. it is real HUGE.... basically mass production of guitar...
the real "original" rodriguez is Miguel Rodriguez... this is solid top class instrument... check some of the model available at GSI here... (im not GSI staff, no commission as well..:)
seow
singapore

Rex

11-27-2003, 08:28 AM

Hi Mega. I tried almost all the guitars in the store, even the ones I couldn't afford, except for the $5000 Ramierez. You needed permission to play it and I had no intention of buying it. The other guitars in the same price range as the Manuel Rodriguez were the Canadian made La Patries and some German made guitars whose name started with an H. I think the brand might have been Hofner? They were nice and I like them, but not as much as the one I bought. I am a third generation from German immigrants so I sort of hoped the German guitar would be my favorite. :)
Moving up in price I tried Takamine and another guitar made by them that started with an H but I can't spell it. I also played some Yamahas. Also a Taylor. Didn't like the skinny neck on the Taylor. By then I was up to $1200 which was my limit to spend. I was happily surprised that the one I liked the best was not the most expensive. Obviously this is a factory made guitar and it had one finish flaw that the salesman did not try to hide. He also did not try to tell me the back was solid rosewood. So I knew what I was buying. Like I said earlier, I've only played one of these so I can only comment on one. I just liked the way it felt under my fingers. Drop me a note at rexg4@juno.com and I'll email you a short clip of me playing it. Well, I'm off to a Thanksgiving feast. Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

MegaBrawn

11-27-2003, 05:18 PM

I felt that the higher end Manuel Rodrigeuz guitas fared well. I won't say they're horrible, but I found nothing about exceptional either. For the prices they were commanding, I would have rather purchased a Bernabe.

Spanish guitars in generally usually have lower quality control (in terms of aesthetics) than compared to the Japanese.I have heard and seen of some terrible aesthetic defects.

I have seen a few entry level Rodrigeuzs with horrible finishes and hair-line cracks. It looked so bad I was shocked they even let the guitar out of the factory.I've even heard of a Bernabe with a hair trapped on the back neck's finishing.

But sound-wise, I have found them to be rather intact despite their visual flaws.

I am always interested to watch the performance of a fellow classical guitarist, and would be delighted to see you perform Rex. I'll get in touch soon. :D

Nausicaa

11-27-2003, 06:12 PM

Thanks a lot for the replies, guys. I have decided not to go with the Rodriguez and have narrowed my choices down to the Alhambra 4P or 5P. I eliminated Cordoba because I read that they sound the same but many reviews complained of finish mistakes.

Does anyone think that the 5P is worth the extra money up from the 4P?

Sorry for all the questions, and thanks for answering!

sseow

11-27-2003, 06:23 PM

nausicaa...wat is your budget...? if u don mind to tell the budget, we can help u better...
megabrawn, i agree with your observation on spanish guitar... i have both a japanese and a spanish guitar... u can tell the different.. but i like the spanish guitar as there simply can produce tat nice tone which u cannot find in the japanses...
but anyone try a chinese handcrafted guitar ??? i visited this guy in china.... he is the no.1 lutheier in china...i tried his guitar and it is just first class. waiting time is 3-6 months. see this top of the range tat build with brazlilan rosewood and spruce/cedar that dried for 100 years...i played one of this in his workshop...
http://www.rjfang.com/rjFangGuitar/jittp.htm
seow
singapore

Nausicaa

11-27-2003, 08:05 PM

Well, I'm trying to stay in the $600 range, but I will go into the $700s to $800 if I know the sound will show where the extra $100 went. But I would prefer if it was $600-$700.

All USD, by the way.

Thanks.

syafiq

11-30-2003, 04:14 AM

Hi Nausicaa,

A few weeks ago my nephew took delivery of an Antonio Aparicio AA30. I was most impressed with its volume and clear trebles. I loved the easy action and nice feel. So, did his teacher. Definitely very Spanish in sound. Finish was superb, flawless. And it is less than $700. It is even more amazing given that it was an internet purchase - i.e. untested and untried. (My Dieter Hopf was also purchased untested, although it was direct from the luthier himself in Germany. I loved my Concierto!). Do check the website, Luthiermusic.com.

BTW, I and nephew live in Malaysia and the guitar was sent from NY. Hope this helps.

sseow

11-30-2003, 05:00 PM

i just got hold of some photos of Manuel Rodrigeuz factory....when u c it, it is like buying guitar from a huge TV production plant in china... all fully automated... factory build... :lol:
also, interview article with the Manuel Rodrigeuz junior during the tour of the factory. give me your e mail if u want me to send u a copy to read...
b :D tw, syafiq, good to know someone across the causeway. i think your antonio aparicio sound interesting...i'm always impressed with dieter hopf but never has a chance to try. i have one interview article with dieter hopf talking about all the details of his guitar construction... quite intersting...
is your concierto refers to a bernabe ?
seow
singapore

Nausicaa

11-30-2003, 06:44 PM

Thank you both for the replies.

syafiq: I will certainly take the time to research that!

sseow: my email is nickrogers86@hotmail.com. I would like to see this information. Sounds like I really won't be buying the Rodriguez now.

Nausicaa

11-30-2003, 07:03 PM

Also, what is the difference between solid rosewood sides and laminated? It seems that all the guitars in my price range are laminated, but what does that mean?

sseow

11-30-2003, 07:20 PM

don bother too much about solid or laminated back and side... it is more important for the guitar to come with SOLID TOP .... as the top is the one that determine the sound quality... the laminated and solid back and side is a matter of perception.... i hv one book use the x-ray picture to study the vibration and tone production of the guitar, the entire study was based on the vibration of the TOP board and not on the back and side...
do u know tat some of the top end ramriez in the past also use laminated back and side.... not to mention the best known smallan with a guitar tat list at US$ 20,000 also use laminated back and side...
i personally own one solid back and side indian rosewood and another one laminated brazilian rosewood back and side... there both sound beautiful....
seow
singapore

Nausicaa

11-30-2003, 07:25 PM

Okay, thanks. I couldn't remember if it was solid top or solid sides that made the difference.

Rex

11-30-2003, 07:40 PM

Seow, I would like to read the interview. My email is rexg4@juno.com. Thanks. Nick, I would not worry about solid versus laminated sides and back in this price range. A solid top is much more important. That is where the sound comes from. Laminated means glued layers like plywood. My point earlier about the sides was merely that I knew what I was buying and the dealer did not try to fool me or take advantage of me. I was not going to buy anything that day and I was also planning to spend double what I actually did when I eventually did make a purchase, but I just loved this particular guitar. I guess it was made for me. :) Looking at the grains from the inside and outside I feel my guitar is all solid wood. The top for sure. But the sides and back are not rosewood, which seems to be the standard for classicals.

sseow

11-30-2003, 07:58 PM

rex... which interview... the factory or hopf??
seow
singapore

Rex

11-30-2003, 08:02 PM

Factory. Thanks.

syafiq

12-01-2003, 07:34 AM

Hi Nausicaa: Yes, do check the Antonio. You have a choice of spruce and cedar tops. If I was looking for a guitar at the price range you mentioned, this would certainly be a strong contender.

Hi Seow: Nice 'meeting' you, too. I was so looking forward to this year's Singapore Guitar Festival by Thomas Music, and disappointed that it had to be cancelled (SARS). I attended last year's event. Were you there? I am sure you have met 'hyz' at the e-borneo forum. He and I do maintain contact from time to time.

My Hopf is the Gran Concierto model which I got in June 2002. The spruce top has opened up nicely. Now, if only my playing can match the concert quality instrument ........

M. Stephenson

12-01-2003, 12:11 PM

I have a model "B" cutaway that I bought used for well under $600. Solid top and laminated back and sides and a built in pick-up. As alluded to by an earlier poster, it has some finish flaws.

Of my guitars, it is my instructors favorite - he really likes the clarity and the eveness of the tone and volume across the strings. I think that the tone is on the bright side and I prefer the tone of my old Aria AC40 (also with a solid top and laminated back and sides)

The Rodriguez can be heard on some of the recordings in the link in my signature. Listen to the ones that have "Mic'ed" beside them, they were recorded with a mirophone instead of with the internal pick-up.

Nausicaa

12-01-2003, 06:39 PM

Hey, those sound really great M. Stephenson! I really enjoyed all of the stuff you've got on there!

I'm starting to get the impression that, to my ear at least, all of the guitars in this price range have an equal sound quality. It seems everytime I look for information I find more guitars that interest me. I looked at the Antonio Aparicio guitars, and they seemed great, but I wasn't able to find too much information about them.

I think I may just go with my instincts on this one and stick with Alhambra.

That cutaway sure sounds nice though!

sseow

12-01-2003, 06:48 PM

nausicaa,
u are right, from my experience, anything cost below $ 2,000 u will not really hear a big different in sound quality....anything cost $ 2,000 and above will probably start to see some differences...but the difference in the top end guitar can only show the different if a good player play on it...
syafiq...
where is this e-borneo forum u are talking..? any forum like this in malaysia u can point me to ...? which state are you based?
seow
singapore

ferraby

12-02-2003, 02:20 AM

Just to clear matters regarding Rodriguez guitars.Yes..their entry levels r mass produced BUT...Manuel Rodriguez himself and his 2 sons do make guitars but it has to be ordered...Miguel Rodriguz and Manuel rodriguez r 2 different luthiers and MAnuel Rodriguez just happens to own a factory that produces entry level guitars.

ferraby

12-02-2003, 02:26 AM

Hey syafiq,

How did u end up buying guitars from the net??Just curious because i am aware that the amount of classical guitar choices in Malaysia is kinda limited and u pretty much have to but abroud if u want something more exclusive or better.Don't u think that itts a risk...buying b4 u actually trying them.I am asking because i am interested in this whole idea but still in doubt.

I am from malaysia too.

RDS

12-02-2003, 07:55 AM

You guys need to check out http://www.e-borneo.com/ab/cgforum.html and http://www.acousticguitar.com/ubbcgi/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Classical+Corner&number=7&DaysPrune=10&LastLogin=

Rex

12-02-2003, 04:37 PM

Personally I would not buy over the internet. I have a friend whose brother had good luck that way but I would have to play the guitar first. I think the better dealers give you an approval period and you can send the guitar back as long as it is in original condition. Of course you need to pay for shipping and also insurance. What I would do, and probably will do in a few years, is plan a vacation around a trip to a major city that also has a major guitar dealer, like GSI or some other reputable dealer with a large stock of guitars. Family vacation plus get to check out some great guitars and maybe buy one! I was lucky that St. Louis has a dealer with a fair selection of student grade classicals, but we don't have anyplace that specializes in nylon string guitars.
RDS, those are interesting sites. But I will have to limit my time in forums! I hardly have enough time to play the way it is. Work and family and church take up most of my time.

syafiq

12-03-2003, 06:48 AM

Hi Seow: there is a big CG forum and going strong at,
http://www.e-borneo.com/ab/cgforum.html. As in here, people there are friendly and many are excellent CGists - from whom I have learned a lot about playing and the music of CG. Many are performers in their own right who are willing to share their experiences. (My apologies to the moderator of this forum if I inadvertently breached forum ethics here). I am a professor with the Medical Faculty, University Malaysia Sarawak, Kuching. Mail me privately (email below).

Ferraby: Life itself is a risk, isn't it? Much more so as my Gran Concierto is tagged at US4500. But, No, in my case if there was any risk its reduced to the minimum due to: 1. The luthier, Mr Dieter Hopf, was storngly recommended by a certain respectable CG personality. 2. I and Mr Hopf not only had email exchanges but also phone conversations. He is a nice gentleman and I knew the risk, if any, would be limited to handling and shipping. I have no doubt about the quality of the instrument and Mr Hopf sent me pictures prior to shipping. Of course, it goes without saying that one need to do a fair bit of research before making the internet plunge.

Apart from the guitar, I have been making numerous internet purchases (music sheets, books, CDs, DVDs, etc) from retailers in the US and UK, and didn't have any problem. It was this positive experience over the years that convinced my nephew to buy his guitar online. He is happy! I am with mine! What you find in KL (you name the guitar stores and I have been there!) tend to be overpriced and seldom meet your need. Of course the fact that I chosed to patronise the well-known internet retailers helped, I suppose. I purchased a Hiscox case from Staffordguitar.com this way, for instance, and the guy there was extremely helpful in ensuring the measurement was done properly.

Feel free to contact me, syafiq@streamyx.com.

Hope this help.

Nausicaa

12-03-2003, 05:00 PM

Thanks for all your help guys! I've decided to go with the Cordoba 50R guitar. Now I've just got to find the best price. I would love to buy from GSI, but it just costs too much here :(.

Does anyone know if the Guitar Center stores stock Cordoba? I think that is my only chance to try one out.

syafiq

12-03-2003, 09:37 PM

Nausicaa: It's good that you have narrowed down your quest to Cordoba. If you have not come across this other forum before, may I point you (and Sseow, too) to the Acoustic Guitar forum - there is a Classical Guitar section moderated by Pauline Leland. Again, a good bunch of people. Several forum members have asked similiar questions in the past. Do a search, say "Cordoba".

http://www.acousticguitar.com/ubbcgi/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number=7&SUBMIT=Go

[Oops, already mentioned by RDS]

Ferraby: At the same forum, members have asked questions pertaining to "internet purchases". Many have done so, mainly due to non-availability of local CG stores. There are also members who are 'ebay experts' as they participate in CG-related transactions on ebay. Again, worth your while to check that out. Internet transaction may not be everyone's cup of tea, but in a land (or Island, in my case, as I am from Borneo) where trying a guitar out is an impossibility, it's been a life-line, really. My advice to would-be online purchasers is, be aware of potential risks of and take all possibe precautions.

ferraby

12-04-2003, 02:16 AM

Syafiq: I am asking because guess what.....i am from Borneo too =D

et041053

12-04-2003, 04:09 AM

et041053

12-04-2003, 04:25 AM

syafiq. Was the Aparicio guitar great sounding? i read an article from the internet that they do not use polyester paint ( the one that makes it shines)so that the sound will be much louder, how long did it take for the item to arrive at your place being that it is an internet purchase. Maybe u can record some audio and let me listen to it if it has what they call the "Old World Sound" :wink: thanks

Nausicaa

12-04-2003, 09:42 AM

Nausicaa GSI has a special on cordoba just a finish defect ( perhaps the paint) why don't u ask them to send u a picture of what it looks like I guess they will respond, or maybe the Alhambra 3C ( condition New). I am not a memeber of the GSI staff or buy a new one and ask them t handpick it for u I think it is worth the extra dollars. Lets face it all factory guitars are overpriced ! Nothing much we can do. have u been to this guitar reviews site
harmonycentral.com ?

I've done just that. I'm currently talking to a GSI staff member about the defect, and he offered to hand pick a new one for me :).

The reviews at HC were part of what sold me on the guitar. Are there any other review sites like that?

Thanks for the continued advice
[/quote]

et041053

12-04-2003, 03:02 PM

if u got the guitar let me know. Hope u got the the best of the bunch! :)

kornflakes

12-07-2003, 02:01 PM

I have a Alhambra 4P, solid cedar top which i feel plays very well, i've noticed it sounds particularly sweet in the middle register with overall good projection. However i am a student guitarist of intermediate ability (Grade 5 ABRSM) and the guitar i had prior to it did not have a solid top so i have'nt tried any other guitars. I am purchasing a Yamaha model 201S because its made of spruce top and is all solid (mahogany back and sides), mainly so i have the tonal variety of cedar and spruce.