Rhythm and Ear Training Book Recommendations?

[luis]

Happy New Year everybody, can anybody recommend any good books (especially with a CD) that deal with reading rhythms? I'm having trouble with the difference between 3/4 and 6/8 and how the accents and grouping change the way it sounds, etc. I'm also interested in any ear training method. Classes got waaay too expensive and I wasn't advancing as much as I would have liked so I'll try the books.
Thanks for any help,

Luis

[Libre]

I can't recommend any books or cd's specifically for rhythm reading. I maybe could shed some light on 3/4 vs 6/8 though.

Let's look at 2 measures, both containing all 8th notes, the first with a time sig of 3/4, the second with a time sig of 6/8.

the 3/4 measure:
This measure would have two groups of three eighth notes. The first note of each group would be accented. So it would go: DEE dee dee, DEE dee dee (or OOOM pom pah, OOOM pom pah). A waltz step rhythm.

the 6/8 measure:
This measure would have three groups of two eighth notes. Again, the first note of each group is accented. Now you have: DEE dee, DEE dee, DEE dee.

It's typical in some Latin music to quickly alternate between signatures, measure to measure, like in Canarios, and MANY other pieces.

Say the following out loud - no, I'm not kidding - and you will have it.

HEY, over HERE waiter! TAco TAco TAco!

[brian richardson]

libre,
perfect example :D

[cdikland]

the 3/4 measure:
This measure would have two groups of three eighth notes. The first note of each group would be accented. So it would go: DEE dee dee, DEE dee dee (or OOOM pom pah, OOOM pom pah). A waltz step rhythm.

You lost me here :shock: It doesnt sound right to me. If I translate the above into a count it would be as follows.

One and two and three andOne and two and three and
Is this right??? What happens if, instead of eighth notes, there were 3 quarter notes? I always assumed that a waltz rhythm was accented on the first beat of each measure..

[deAlmeida]

um...that seems right... a bit confusing/awkward how the wording with the accents work out though there, cdikland

3/4 time maybe better to sound out like .. one two three one two three one two three one two three etc.

[cdikland]

um...that seems right... a bit confusing/awkward how the wording with the accents work out though there, cdikland.
But if a 1/4 note receives one beat and the measure contains all 1/8th notes, translating Libre example of DEE dee dee, DEE dee dee to a count, that is how it would be isnt it? That to me seems strange.... The 6/8 sig seems right as the accent is on each 1/4 beat or every other 1/8th

[Libre]

To CD and others,
Upon reflecting on what I have written, I think I have made an error. The examples are right, but the measure I described as 3/4 is 6/8, and visa-versa.
SO
If a measure is 3/4 and has ALL eighth notes, there would be 3 groups of 2 notes each. TAco TAco TAco. Or ONEand TWOand THREEand.
If a measure is 6/8 and has ALL eighth notes, there would be 2 groups of 3 notes each. ONEtwo three FOURfive six.

Does that make it better?

[cdikland]

It sure does.... :D
All those years of studying music and I thought I had it all wrong... Hope I can cancel my ebay listing for the sale of my guitars. :P

[compagnito]

go to flamenco-world.com & look for "Understanding Flamenco" by Faustino Nunez.

CD & book.

[Riggs]

Although I haven't used it myself I've heard a lot of good stuff about 'Rhythmic Training' by Robert Starer. It's not guitar specific. When I used to play trumpet, I knew some people that swore by it. I think it's cheap too. Like 7 bucks.

[luis]

The example of 3/4 vs 6/8 really helped, thanks so much guys. So, when you read a rhythm there's two things to take into account, the meter and rhythm right? Like a poem, the # of syllables is the meter, the accents on the words is the rhythm. Is that correct?
Also, I guess then that where the accents fall on the notes gives u the time signature? What if you want a 3/4 meter but accented: one AND two AND three and. Is this question relevant? I'm sure it would sound different than: ONE and TWO and THREE and.
I have so many questions so thanks for all the help!

Luis

[deAlmeida]

go to flamenco-world.com & look for "Understanding Flamenco" by Faustino Nunez.

I was thinking the same thing, but I'm not sure cdik is into flamenco... if he's not, he would definitely be getting in over his head with flamenco compas

[Don Owens Jr]

To CD and others,
Upon reflecting on what I have written, I think I have made an error. So it would initially seem, but my instructor tries to get me to include an entire measure in one beat, in which case, both time signatures seem to be two sets of triplets, one on the down beat, one on the up beat. You are probably playing the music that fast. Anyway, I have to slow down to learn it and I use three beats for 3/4 and two for 6/8.