Tips for concentration???

[ricecrackerphoto]

hey everyone,

after about 15 years of being mostly self-taught classical/flamenco player, i'm taking lessons again and am determined to seriously devote myself to technique and getting better. i've been noodling around all this time and though i haven't really improved, its been fun. now i'm ready to start working.

my question is about focusing concentration while playing. any tips? i've heard that breathing is important. sometimes i am completely in the zone and it is great. other times, i'm wondering what those seeds in rye bread are called.

thanks!
doug

[WillBee]

my question is about focusing concentration while playing. any tips? i've heard that breathing is important. sometimes i am completely in the zone and it is great. other times, i'm wondering what those seeds in rye bread are called.

thanks!
doug

Mental control over your body using discipline? Sounds suspiciously un-American...

1 word --- Ritalin!

[Jordanao11]

Caraway -- the answer is Caraway seeds. I think.

[ricecrackerphoto]

ritalin is a great idea. does GSI offer a sampler pack?

and thanks for the rye bread answer. now i can move onto bigger questions while i play scales like "who puts those pimentos in my olives?"

doug

[M. Stephenson]

Visualize one or two steps ahead of what you are playing.

It takes practice. The more you do it the easier it gets - and you will start to make far fewer mistakes as you play.

Sounds simple, but it is hard and the rewards are great.

[Section_10]

Concentration? i'm pretty familiar with this subject, I did a senior thesis on buddhist psychology when I was in college. Concentration was a big practice in that. That and mindfulness have become incredibly important to musicians as well as every other profession.

Look under the Shambhala publications for books. There are several on this topic. Most meditations aimed towards concentration involve some type of breathwork so you should look into that as well.

But they're probably right, most Americans might just go for the ritalin. Although this doesnt help with concentration but suppresses the mind. Eliot Fisk would be the only beneficiary for this.

[ChrisAM86]

practice your pieces so much that they are literally engraved in your brain. you shouldn't have to concentrate whatsoever when playing music, your brain should relax while your fingers do the work. if you practice correctly, then you will perform at your best. I find that my best performances usually happen when I'm thinking about things other than music while I play, completely not concentrated on the music whatsoever.

[Todd]

practice your pieces so much that they are literally engraved in your brain. you shouldn't have to concentrate whatsoever when playing music, your brain should relax while your fingers do the work. if you practice correctly, then you will perform at your best. I find that my best performances usually happen when I'm thinking about things other than music while I play, completely not concentrated on the music whatsoever.

Why play, if one isnt concentrating on music?

I think maybe, not thinking about what you're doing
technically is a good thing in performance,
but i dont see the advantage in not concentrating on
the music.
When i play a concert, im not picking myself apart technically,
but i AM getting way into what im playing. Ideally, enjoying
the piece from more the listener's point of view.
Letting my fingers do what i trained them to do.

I'd like to hear you expand on what it is you think about
when you play a concert.
Just curious.
TK

[daniel711]

practice your pieces so much that they are literally engraved in your brain. you shouldn't have to concentrate whatsoever when playing music, your brain should relax while your fingers do the work. if you practice correctly, then you will perform at your best. I find that my best performances usually happen when I'm thinking about things other than music while I play, completely not concentrated on the music whatsoever.
Not concentrating on the music, whatsoever!!! No offense, but I really don't think I'd be interested in hearing you play! Music is HARD WORK... And so is learning to relax. There is no contradiction there - in fact learning to relax is probably the harder of the two. Mindless repetition is NOT the way to master music. It requires mental stamina, which requires concentration, which requires relaxation.... How many people can you think of who really know how to relax??

[cdikland]

If it were possible to play and NOT concentrate on music I would be a master. :D

[ChrisAM86]

practice your pieces so much that they are literally engraved in your brain. you shouldn't have to concentrate whatsoever when playing music, your brain should relax while your fingers do the work. if you practice correctly, then you will perform at your best. I find that my best performances usually happen when I'm thinking about things other than music while I play, completely not concentrated on the music whatsoever.
Not concentrating on the music, whatsoever!!! No offense, but I really don't think I'd be interested in hearing you play! Music is HARD WORK... And so is learning to relax. There is no contradiction there - in fact learning to relax is probably the harder of the two. Mindless repetition is NOT the way to master music. It requires mental stamina, which requires concentration, which requires relaxation.... How many people can you think of who really know how to relax??

So, because I don't focus on the music during a performance means that I put no thought into it? Sorry, but this comment was just retarded. First of all, when I practice, I make sure that I practice what I will be doing during the performance. So does this mean I practice with a metronome and just play like a machine? Of course not, I make sure that musicality comes first, and then I perfect my technique. All types of phrasing that I plan on doing I already have in my head, so they come out completely naturally during a performance.

Most of the time you mess up, it's because you will be focusing on the fretboard/soundhole on where your fingers need to go. You look at these spots and say to yourself in your head, "OK, fingers go here" and in doing so, you can possibly get confused and second guess yourself, or even worse, you can mess up the phrase because you have too many things on your mind. Not only are you thinking about being technically proficient, but you're also thinking about how you should phrase a part of the piece. This overloads your brain and combining this with nervousness will just make you more prone to make a mistake. It also makes it feel like the piece you are playing is ten times longer than it really is.

When I'm playing, I'm in a state in which I'm almost asleep. It feels like I'm playing for myself, noone else in the room, and after I get into the piece I lose all senses except for my ability to hear and my sight generally weakens to the point that I can distinguish the different frets on my guitar. Sometimes I'll think of what I had to lunch that day, maybe a good recording I heard, maybe think about something that happened in my life that reflects the piece of music I'm playing, hell I might even be thinking of some random hot girl naked. While I'm doing this, the part of my brain that controls my fingers is also injecting all of the things I practiced before the performance. I never think of where my fingers should go, if I should phrase something differently, etc, because I've already practiced it before the concert and it will come out naturally.

One thing I suggest is taking a piece of tape and putting it behind the neck of your guitar on the 7th fret, it tends to help a LOT during performance, guiding your fingers to the right spot.

In conclusion, not concentrating during the concert does not mean neglecting the music. It just means that I focused on the music so much during my practice that it will automatically come out of my guitar the way I want it to without effort.

[daniel711]

ChrisAM86
If you are THAT well prepared for your performances, then more power to you. But I think that the process of PREPARING is what's at issue here. After all, even the best players in the world spend the vast majority of their time practicing, not concertizing. So, the question is, does one need to learn to concentrate in order to develop technique and achieve the level you are referring to. I believe the original poster was interested in developing as a guitarist, not necessarily giving a peak performance.

In any case, it is your complete dismissal of the need for concentration in your first post that I was replying to. Perhaps you should have elaborated a little more, as you did in you second post...

[Jubilee Valence]

..........this comment was just retarded........
"When I'm playing, I'm in a state in which I'm almost asleep. It feels like I'm playing for myself, noone else in the room, and after I get into the piece I lose all senses...." Sometimes I'll think....thinking of some random hot girl naked....I never think of where my fingers should go, if I should phrase something differently, etc, because I've already practiced it ...

Well, there's a pretty good perception of THE ZONE; and, "believe it or not", some further distractions that have gained your confidence over time

The "Happy Place" was essential to the methodocity utilized for the continuing survival of POWs, and can always help in stressful episodes not requiring "amp'd" actionings

The Zone is complete withdrawal from tangible concious forethought; And not everyone relies on the same "zone", or level of sub-conciousness; (in performing or practicing--or, for that matter, mastery of any trade requiring learned skills; --in the latter examples, it's being thought that said skills become "entrenched" in the sleep phase i.e. at night)

We've had some "good ones" about the "right-brainers/left brainers" learning and theory/creativity etc etc--so extreme examples of each, while accomplishing similar end results, may seem and even "be" in total opposition; Yet it goes on..."pleasingly" becoming--music....

On topic for **Doug, I'd like to contribute my personal "cross the fingers" & hope it works this time way of achieving a beneficial level of thought conducive to maximizing practice time efficiency--
Certain pieces, i.e. "sections" of those pieces, evoke deep emotional states that typically transcend some folks into certain levels of an altered-conciousness; This type of impetus can sometimes propel one immediately into a "zone" of sorts where creativity overcomes concentration and "things happen"...
Although, unfortunately, I'm only able to provide the perception opinionated by one creative mind and it's methods...

JV

**If having the notion of "learning" an established piece, it must be first "heard" in my head and then broken down into viably recognizable and allowable recreationings...i.e. "riffs" or intervals, changes, chordings, arpeggios, all the familiar concepts that are at one's fingertips...and then chronologically re-assembled into the desired end piece; Note that "I don't read" music; I make music...[uh-sometimes!...& that's even debatable!]

'couldn't do it any other way! :wink:

[ChrisAM86]

ChrisAM86
If you are THAT well prepared for your performances, then more power to you. But I think that the process of PREPARING is what's at issue here. After all, even the best players in the world spend the vast majority of their time practicing, not concertizing. So, the question is, does one need to learn to concentrate in order to develop technique and achieve the level you are referring to. I believe the original poster was interested in developing as a guitarist, not necessarily giving a peak performance.

In any case, it is your complete dismissal of the need for concentration in your first post that I was replying to. Perhaps you should have elaborated a little more, as you did in you second post...

The best advice I can give is practice as much as possible, very focused practiced, not jamming, and perform at every opportunity you get.

[Tomas-Lobos]

This is not a concentration method per se, but a learning method that is taught by Dr. Leo Welch, the music professor at Marshall University. I studied with him several years ago and this was probably the most useful technique for learning that he taught me.
To learn a piece, start with the last measure. Then the next to the last measure and then the third from the last measure and so on. Personally, I do this two measures at a time. I break the piece up into sections. I then learn each section in this manner. The last section first until I can play the entire piece. The result is that as you play the piece it is more familiar to you as you play through to the end because the last of that piece is what you've practiced most.
http://www.music.fsu.edu/welch.htm

[daniel711]

Yeah, that's what David Russel says he does. Must be something to it!

[Todd]

Im sure there IS something to that.

But i also think that, one can pay equal attention
to all measures, wether they learn it from the front, or back.
You should be able to start playing from any point in the piece,
either way.

There are tons of ways to study and take in a piece of music.
The key is finding what works for you.

[Boyscout]

There are tons of ways to study and take in a piece of music.
The key is finding what works for you.

Agreed. I like to read through a piece from beginning to end when I start working on it. I go slow, stop when I come to something nasty put a bracket over the top of it--so I can come back to that spot later--then keep on going. After I've read through it, I got back and work on those brackets, starting only with the notes underneath it, then expanding on either side of the section so I can expand it.

To memorize something I'll take it by section--if there's no clear sections I'll go by pages. I'm fourtunate enough to have a semi photographic memory, and I can visualize the page of music in my head. Sometimes even before I can play the piece well, I have it memorized.

As far as concentration: working pieces in sections is great for that. Maybe focus on a only a few bars at a time, it makes the task more managable.

[ricecrackerphoto]

thanks for all the suggestions. i guess the gist of all this is "to each hiis own". guess i'll have to find my own path but i especially like the memorization of pieces backwards tip. a friend had mentioned that to me and said that it insued that he finished each piece strongly.

i also like the idea of thinking a bar ahead which so far seems a great way of focusing without being fixated on what my fingers are currently looking like on the frets.

so guess i'll be eating more fish, taking yoga, and meditating more often.

[Jubilee Valence]

...I think Todd & I are maybe the only non-readers....and for the life of me!--I just can't imagine it!....but "reading"--to me-- is a weakness i.e. "readers" say to learn/play a piece, that they "need it on paper"-but they hear just fine...what was it on the "mood for a day" thing?...."fingerings"!......tab?--or Mel Bay's Chord books?

I can concede that if one was deaf; tone deaf or the like, and needed to perform published and documentable pieces, then great! Learn to read it and write it and play it--but in what order?

If...blind, the obverse/reverse; axiomatic

If blessed with both senses.......how does--or why does anyone choose to retard one of their pristene senses to allow for a crutch?

retard?...muscles "waste away" from lack of use i.e. they're killed

the "mind's eye" will "show you the paper"

unless you kill it

I "read" that which needs to be read--in & of that medium --the printed /spoken word

I "hear ya"

AND I "read ya'"

AND......

I LOVE all'a ya'

just ramblin' man

ps Doug, GREAT SITE!!!!

[ricecrackerphoto]

thanks, jubilee!

non-reading??? that's a level of nuttiness that i can't even comment on. without sheet music, i'd be playing black sabbath covers all day long.

doug

[Todd]

Then, in a way, it could be said that, reading, exclusively, can
be not the greatest thing for developing the ears.

There are many top players, whom played quite extensively
Before learning to read.

I think it was Pepe Romero who said he played the Concerto de Aranjuez
before he could read.

He also claimed that one should learn to play music first,
and become a proficient player, and only then should one
learn to read music.

I dont doubt many people think this is hogwash.

But i absolutely agree with him.
Just as we learn to speak, before we learn to write.

[Jubilee Valence]

...."Just as we learn to speak, before we learn to write." :shock: :!: :!: :arrow: :?:

"THAT"....floored me! [*where'd that come from?]

Within it's base meaning is crystal-clear and mind-boggling relevence to this seemingly endless polar conflict that had yet to be given a lucid, vivid, analogy in demonstrating a justification of sorts towards one of the key elements.

I've heard- walk before run; and the good ol' "crawl" before walk etc but never with such a profound relevence

BUT-and to think of the very elements involved in the problems of the generally acknowleged standards relevent to the "written" word and it's intendent--"transcending" of what begins and ends ultimately as thought...to an optimal, joint, and concise, understanding.[-for, and of, "all"]--let alone it's/the "shoot yer'self in the foot!" aspect as soon as you apply this wisdom outwards towards the subject at hand! :lol:
Problems?"huh"?
(Think "Jubi-gram";) Sequence, spelling, subject; and example, analogy, colloquialism(s), buzzwords etc--all are lost due to the mediocrity of the level of perception or awareness or even in the level of interest-"flux"(a "time" tag; "mood" specifically in & of the "changability" thereof if you will...) of the average reader.
Problems!
"Levels" must be matched; a la the "common denominator" axiom from our most elementary mathematics(another communication device)

I'll re-iterate: "All can read"; Now, and but for the most part, "society" i.e. "civilization"--including the highest level of proficiencies in academically applied comprehensionings will allow within the spectrum, a certain arc, and within, a degree of factorings to establish this baseline of perceived thought as written and expressed as societal "Law"[note: levels above this, such as military specified, is moot]

"Most" will adhere; In where some will not, and yet others cannot, neccessary measures are in place to effect the smooth continuity of civilization.

What's any of this to do with our subject?(whatever that was/is?)
tsk tsk tsk!....moody!
Perhaps don Romero's ideology effects a deep, core, realization of a "for the most part", neccessary position of "look within"

So, as "All can read", the overburden regarding comprehension, intent, etc must be sheepishly addressed and discussed, again, "per level"

"If" *level dictates, any or similar elements *"may" be observed as being wholly analolgous within the comparison...

So,
Therefore it is which particular academic institution that "creates" by and with; of it's dogma and practitioners; "that" which is of each of the examples of the music that is here today, question mark :P

Newly analogous to "me" for one, & again to the "walk/run" wisdom, is the "perhaps evident to most" or again "perhaps neccessary for some", learned or experienced, "states" in growth, of anger/humility etc and any resultant effects, be they per individual or societal/cultural, and either aberrant or within towards a normalcy, or part & parcel of that normalcy,--everyday life!....

I'm acceding that only "positive" can flourish forth out of the evolutionary changes, perhaps subtle, but evident nonetheless, in our fellow member and ofttimes trailblazer, TK
(while I rant on...)
JV :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

[Tomas-Lobos]

Ahem, can you say rote?

[Libre]

To learn a piece, start with the last measure. Then the next to the last measure and then the third from the last measure and so on.
That SOUNDS like a good idea - and I can see some value in it. Problem for me, though, is getting a piece of music to make any sense, when learned like that. You think an actor learns a script like that? WHy is this any different?

[ykabban]

Has everyone forgotten about Paco. He can't read a lick!! And he's da' man.

I agree with Todd on this one. I abandoned(but not completely :? ) sheet music years ago, but you need a good ear to do that.

[Todd in FL]

How to concentrate?

Enthusiasm is the key. If you're not enthused about the music you practice then you'll fall asleep. Why practice a piece you don't like? I play them cuz I enjoy them. If you like them then the audience will too.

Another way to concentrate is to play live at least once a week. If you play live then you'll always be thinking about the gig you have to play and you don't want to mess up during the preformance so you'd better practice so that doesn't happen. If the audience claps for a song you played that you made mistakes on just think how they'll react to a perfect performance...

If you're falling asleep during practice get an energy drink. There are so many of them out there that there is no excuse for not being able to concentrate.

[Tomas-Lobos]

Libre,
Sometimes I'll have to learn several measures in this manner to get a feel for what the piece is supposed to sound like. Usually, it's a piece I've heard and and already know how it should sound. But learning a piece with this method really helps me with the fingering which is not always what is indicated on the sheet music. It's something that works for me so I use it a lot. I'm constantly working on my sight reading with the goal that someday I'll be able to read the music and play through from the first measure in order to learn a piece. I can do that now with a lot of advanced/beginner to intermediate stuff. The guitar has challenged me and humbled me more than anything I've ever attempted to learn or do. But by golly, I'm enjoying the process. :wink:

[rdubb]

How to concentrate?


If you're falling asleep during practice get an energy drink. There are so many of them out there that there is no excuse for not being able to concentrate.

Yeah, and burn out your adrenal glands and make yourself more susceptible to injury and overall body burnout.

I was a heavy coffee drinker for many years, loved it with practicing of course. It defnitely contributed to the onset of an RSI.

How's this for an incredibly off the wall and novel idea.....if you're falling asleep then maybe you should REST. Your body will like it.

[sanman]

:) I find that I do my best practicing ( ie; concertration) when I have a few distractions. I usually have on the television, or the radio. I find this also helps in performing. In a performance setting, there are often distractions, and this has helped.