What is wrong with the forum?

[Pepe Vergara]

Well, the title is just to make sure you take a look to the thread. I have noticed that right after the change of the forum structure and look, participation has declined. Of course, some of the heated discussions were kind or in the personal-opinion-non-guitar-related, but there was some action, and some good posts developed.

I monitor the forum everyday and have noticed that there is less and less participation. In the meantime, other forums have increased (Delcamp.net). Delcamp does monitor and contact posters when politically incorrect postings are made. They have a way of discouraging people who does not restrain form trying to offend someone else. Delcamp is French. GSI is American, but both attract people from all over the world. What do you think is happening? Do you think it was the summer? global warming? politics? Can you comment on this? Maybe we can add dynamic to the forum again!!!

[Great Googly Moogly]

One can't deny that there's a definite positive correlation between global warming and the lack of activity here on the forum. There's just no doubt about it. :)

[Mister Lovaguitara]

yeah..... who wants to talk when you can surf?? LOL
but honestly, I agree. I don't think there is much we can do about it. people will do what thay want to do.

[Faya]

One can't deny that there's a definite positive correlation between global warming and the lack of activity here on the forum. There's just no doubt about it. :)

:lol::lol:

i'm busy.

[Richard]

I monitor the forum everyday and have noticed that there is less and less participation. In the meantime, other forums have increased (Delcamp.net).
Pepe, I think Delcamp, AG and GSI are all quiet right now, with AG being the most quiet. Chalk it up to summer, or uh, post-summer.

[classicalguitar83]

Like Faya said...I'm busy. I'm in my senior year of my undergrad studies so most of my focus is on school (not to mention getting all of my rep ready for my senior recital).

On a personal note, one thing that has sort of driven me away from this forum is all of the damn spamers who have shown up and started polluting this forum. Anytime that happens I normally just drop out of a site but since this site is about classical guitar I've decided to stick around....just not as much.

[DJH]

How about this :
You're looking for a place where you can go and have a drink in a town you don't know. You walk into a small bar where there isn't much going on; a handful of locals who seem to know each other really well all stop talking when you walk in and then start talking to each again in low voices, obviously commenting on your out-of-town appearance. After ordering a couple of beers you try to make conversation, but it is clear that you need to *earn* your place in the bar - you ain't nothing but a newcomer who is going to have to fit in. You finish your drinks and bid everyone a good evening.

Different bar, different situation.
The place is a huge theme bar, one of a big chain. There are nigh-on a hundred people inside and almost everyone seems friendly (there's always *one* who looks like he/she wants a fight, but hey...).
You order drinks, check out who is around and try to chat. You meet a lot of people, but after a while you get a little tired of the blandness of the conversation. You can't seem to actually get anything other than small-talk out of anyone. People come and go very often. The bar tender looks like he wants to get to the end of his shift...

The first bar might be difficult to feel comfortable in at first, but some of the folk there could well be rough diamonds with a lot of interesting things to say. The second is perhaps more frequented, but the quality of the exchanges you're going to have is unlikely to be as profound. In the end, with a bit of patience, you might discover that the small local bar is where you are happier.

Okay, I'm not saying the GSI forum is like a dusty local bar (and I've only just poked my nose over at Delcamp today, don't know it at all well) but there is surely a parallel in terms of attraction for newcomers. If people come to an un-dynamic place, they are less likely to write much on a topic like classical guitar if they feel that they are going to be taken to task for rocking the boat. I've only had good experiences here from the welcomes on in, but I can imagine that people looking in from the outside see it as a less open atmosphere than on some discussion forums.

Solution? Not simple: wait for more people to join and stay; make the place a teensy bit more welcoming by toning down the judgement meted out to those who say something that makes you flip.
I must check the forum twice a day, but I don't write very often because I don't feel like I have anything useful to add to many of the discussions.
What's better? Filling up space with lots of blah-blah or saying something meaningful?

It's almost midnight, I'm off to bed.
If all this sounds like a load of tripe, blame it on the empty bottle next to me. It's the piano that's been drinking, not me...

Dominic

[Sandra]

I monitor the forum everyday and have noticed that there is less and less participation. In the meantime, other forums have increased (Delcamp.net). Delcamp does monitor and contact posters when politically incorrect postings are made. They have a way of discouraging people who does not restrain form trying to offend someone else.
We need more nazi moderators! Just kidding. :p

While Delcamp does have fairly strict moderation, it is all based on Mr. Delcamp's rules, such as "no politics, no religion" and respect of copyright. The mods there are mostly all pretty active posters who do a lot to encourage more posting. They also dangle a large carrot... you have to post and join group levels in order to get the free goodies, such as an extensive collection of free sheet music. We don't have anything like that here. :(

I think we lost some people during the transition. It started with the database corruption this past Spring, then there was a re-vamp that used some oddball software before vBulletin.

People like Libre were always good at stirring up the pot, and even Jubi (whose posting style always reminded me of nails on a chalkboard) kept the place lively.

And like classicalguitar83 said, the influx of spammers has been a turnoff. I have given Dave Tate some of my thoughts on this privately (I admin a vBull forum that averages 5K posts per day, so have a bit of experience dealing with spammers) but I never heard back from him.

How about this... if each of us that comes here on a daily basis tries to make at least one post per day, we could liven the joint up a bit. Take this thread as an example... it's gotten 6 (edit: make that 7!) replies in a matter of hours. We can do it! 8)

[brian richardson]

to block spam,
can't the forum be made to not allow
'new members' to post links until
they've made 20(?) posts?
just an idea, don't know if it will work.
i still think the source/beginning of all this
spam is from a present/former member(s)
with an axe to grind against GSI.
too weird no other 'guitar' forums get attacked
like this one.
and it really only happens when the cat(dave tate) is away.
reminds me of a certain time 'round here when 'enemies'
showed up on weekends to trash the place.
anyone remember those days??? i do.

[Pepe Vergara]

It sounds like the idea of having a monitor or several may help (soup nazi?). We could change the name to "greeters", like at Walmart. Feeling appreciated and recognized and welcome is very important, and it does not have to be at the bar, at the forum would be good.

Incentive? Uhmmmm! We discussed the open house about five years ago? was that long? Meeting in person gives a boost to the acquantainship (sp?). Nacio offered to be a monitor. Maybe he could get a set of strings as an incentive. :)

I like the number of responses. So we are here, it is just that we need incentive from good subjects, correct?

[brian richardson]

i've always tried to welcome new members
when i notice them.

nice to see you around pepe!!

i don't know about that open house idea,
maybe if paramedics were on hand.:lol:

[sanderdude]

Well: I found the forum while looking to buy a guitar. Then I built one instead, and now I am working full time for Brian Burns who taught me in his shop to build my 1st guitar. I am going to start on 3 more guitars simultaneously to amortize setup and part making. A cedar and another spruce classical and a cypress-spruce flamenco. too busy to post but I am still looking at the forum almost daily. Re-learning to play is painfully slow.
Really I don't think there is anything wrong with the forum at all. Just a normal ebb and flow in the grand scheme of things. Somehow this forum seems much more user friendly than delcamp to me.

[Sandra]

Okay, Pepe, in an effort to do my part and create some content, I've started a "show off your headstock/rosette" thread.

http://forum.guitarsalon.com/showthread.php?t=9878

[brian richardson]

since we brought up spam,
2 more show up.

[Tim Miklaucic]

I agree we have to do something about the spammers. I don't know the solution, but we will look further into it. It's really an invasion of privacy.

As a second matter, we at GSI need to make our site more exciting with new things all the time. We are working on this. At the moment,we are trying out a new technology platform for guitarsalon.com to see if it can be as good a store as the current one, but more flexible for multi-media and other contributions.

Once we have a better platform, we will be asking our frequent visitors and friends to help provide us with videos, recordings, reviews of products, concerts, CDs, etc. We will try to create some type of multi-media lessons and live and recorded events at GSI. All in the idea stage, but we think we can do this in the coming year.

We'd love to have your thoughts and suggestions.

Tim

[Todd]

Cant stand the spam!!
Still, ive been posting fairly regularly. :)
TK

[rdubb]

i think the forum software changeover shed some people. i'm fairly active and it even threw me off from wanting to hang out for a month or so.

what can you do. i appreciate the new software now, but just having to deal with a change irked me for a while.

i still think this is the most intelligent and well behaved forum i've found related to music or classical guitar.

[classicalguitar83]

I just recently registered onto Delcamp's site. Man it's confusing though I'm sure with time I'll be able to navigate without a problem. Not to mention there are a TON of rules to abide by....though that may not be a bad thing (in reference to all the spam here). So I agree that this site is more user friendly.

[Richard]

I just recently registered onto Delcamp's site. Man it's confusing though I'm sure with time I'll be able to navigate without a problem.
Since none of these sites have an avalanche of postings, there really is no reason to set up so many topic categories. It would be best if all threads just appeared sequentially by the most recent posting time.

[Guitar Slim]

A couple of thoughts.

First, I noticed a sharp decline in the number and quality of discussions on this forum long before the software switch. And I'm convinced that a lot of the more casual members never found their way back after the switch because of the change in address.

The upside is, even though there have been fewer posts here of late, I have to say the quality of content, and the level of civility has gone up -- if only a bit. Though the spam is getting really annoying.

Regarding the Delcamp forum -- I initially had the same impression: enforced niceness, too many rules, too many rank beginners with questions like "I want to play Bach on guitar, how can I do that?" etc. etc.

But in fact, there are many experienced and knowledgable members at Delcamp, including some great players. And excellent threads are going on there almost every day -- discussions of composers, style traits, theory, manuscripts etc; in-depth discussions of all aspects of technique; an entire sub-forum devoted to home-recording and gear -- and more. Not to mention the free scores, and the free server space for MP3s and videos!

Because the membership there is so large, it's true there are more beginners, casual players and just plain idiots there. But in terms of overall numbers, I daresay that in total there are substantially more good posters and threads there than there are here. And more good performances posted too, even if you have to wade through some pretty poor efforts as well.

Delcamp is a huge community (in CG terms anyway), with an amazing amount of content. Embarrasingly, I've seen more than one GSI expat throw temper tantrums (in print!) at Delcamp when they've come up against some of the more restrictive rules. But considering the content at the site, and the amount of work that must go into maintaining it, and the fact that it's all free -- I am more than happy to follow the rules without complaint.

I've remained active on the GSI forum because I've made some good friends here, and because it was the first online community I became in involved in. But I have become frustrated with a lot things that have happened here. And for the moment, Delcamp remains the most active and overall the best CG site I've found on the internet.

[cglover]

Increase guitar related content to foster community. Free sheet music, midi files, tabs, guitar history, nail care, beginner/intermediate/advanced instruction tutorials. People are hungry for knowledge. This site becomes a one stop shop for all your classical guitar needs as the content grows.

PS: I think Chris said it all.

[Guitar Slim]

BTW, I hope no one takes my above comments as criticism of GSI itself. Delcamp is a community-run forum administered by dozens of moderators all over the world. GSI is a small business, and the forum is only moderated by one person who I am sure has other duties to attend to in addition to this forum.

I will say that I think the creation of this discussion forum is a brilliant way to promote GSI, and I believe that improving the forum and making it more active can only do good things for GSI's business in the long run. But I don't fault GSI for what's been happening (or not happening) here.

And we members kind of need to take the high ground too. Only the members can improve the level of activity, discourse and content here. If the forum goes comatose from lack of activity, GSI will have little motivation to put time or money into improving it.

[GG Guitar]

Well, the title is just to make sure you take a look to the thread. I have noticed that right after the change of the forum structure and look, participation has declined. Of course, some of the heated discussions were kind or in the personal-opinion-non-guitar-related, but there was some action, and some good posts developed.

I monitor the forum everyday and have noticed that there is less and less participation. In the meantime, other forums have increased (Delcamp.net). Delcamp does monitor and contact posters when politically incorrect postings are made. They have a way of discouraging people who does not restrain form trying to offend someone else. Delcamp is French. GSI is American, but both attract people from all over the world. What do you think is happening? Do you think it was the summer? global warming? politics? Can you comment on this? Maybe we can add dynamic to the forum again!!!

I put it down to the American sub-prime mortgage crisis. The funds for high-end classical guitars have dried up stateside.

[Pepe Vergara]

I put it down to the American sub-prime mortgage crisis. The funds for high-end classical guitars have dried up stateside.

Given how low the dollar is compared to the Euro, I would think that American guitar makers would be making lots of sales. But nothing. I think it is the summer. Why stay inside when you can go surfing? Someone said that!

A guitar that costs $6K in Spain would cost $6K here if the dollar were one to one with the Euro.

At 1.42, a $6K guitar in Spain is $8,500 here in the US. Poor Spanish people must be suffering like crazy, no sales in the US, and the Chinese competitions in their tails. :(

[Great Googly Moogly]

It smells like a skunk humped an onion in it. What a rip off, what a piece of crap. F#&* YOU ESTABAN!!!!I've said this before but this signature is absolutely hilarious.

[thedrizzle]

I've said this before but this signature is absolutely hilarious.

I'll co-sign on that!

[Tim Miklaucic]

These are all helpful comments. I think you'll find in the coming months (may take 2 or 3) that every part of the GSI site will improve. We are looking to create much more dynamic content and have some exciting plans to do so. Hearing the remarks in this thread makes us realize how important it is for us to continue to improve.

Thanks!

Tim

[Steve Lin]

Hi all. I've just been really busy with too many ongoing projects. Don't even have time to ask that pretty girl out, you know. This is a very valuable forum though--thank you GSI.

[cardenas]

Honestly....I think the lower participation is due to the changing of that little dialog box on the old home page going away. You know that little teaser box of the forum that gave the latest postings right away.....it was so much easier to keep up on the latest discussions that way. I'd suggest bringing that little box back...it's so much easier to hook newbies....

[cgram@adelphia.net]

Yeah that's the only thing I still miss about the old forum. Most of the features that were lacking in the transitional software version over the summer have been restored, but that one element is still sorely lacking. And it makes the forum less easy to use.

[Guitar Slim]

Honestly....I think the lower participation is due to the changing of that little dialog box on the old home page going away. You know that little teaser box of the forum that gave the latest postings right away.....it was so much easier to keep up on the latest discussions that way. I'd suggest bringing that little box back...it's so much easier to hook newbies....


Come to think of it, that's how I found my way to the forum. I had no idea it existed, but I was browsing the GSI guitar pages when it caught my eye...

[jtran_95136]

I will post this reply and I am NOT OFFEND ANYBODY.
Take a look at this thread below, seems like there are a small number of people post a topic and someone said something that ticked them off, rubbed them the wrong way and things go wacko. I think we are all mature professional and should not be like that. This make people avoid to get involved. This problem NEVER happen in DELCAMP forum.
http://forum.guitarsalon.com/showthread.php?t=9856
And this is not the first time I had seen.
--JT

[Dave Tate]

Hi guys,

I miss the "recent posts" box as well. Believe me, with all the other fixes this forum had to undergo during the summer, that would've been the first. Unfortunately, it's simply impossible.

It'll be back soon though, I promise. I'm working on a solution.

Cheers,
Dave

[Pepe Vergara]

... I think we are all mature professional and should not be like that. This make people avoid to get involved. This problem NEVER happen in DELCAMP forum. .... -JT

Hi JT:

I think your comment is right on the money. However, we have to live in a world where everyone is different, some are more mature than others, etc. The key to live harmoniously is the respect for others. Sometimes there is a bit of extra hormonal energy that comes up in a not so formal way. I do not think it is disrespect, but rather emotions that somehow add spice, human factor, likes and dislikes, to a controversy that challenges the balance and maturity of the others, but that it could be helpful and entertaining.

If you notice at the Acoustic Guitar forum, some of the veterans over there found that the way to eliminate the extra-caffeine person is to ignore it. Some of the less formal people can learn from the formal ones, and vice-versa. I do see that for a first-time visitor, one of those controversies can decide their participation or not in the fourm. That is why I think it is important that we have if not one or several moderators, at least one or two greeters.

Dave does not have to be burden with the extra work. Some of the members have offered to do that. We as a community can agree (or not agree) that those individuals would have some polished human relations that could address elegantly any issue of misuse. They do not have the need to have power to delete or edit post. Just the goodwill and desire to greet and make people feel good to be in the forum. Above all, to help them in their search.

[el baroda]

I will post this reply and I am NOT OFFEND ANYBODY.
Take a look at this thread below, seems like there are a small number of people post a topic and someone said something that ticked them off, rubbed them the wrong way and things go wacko. I think we are all mature professional and should not be like that. This make people avoid to get involved. This problem NEVER happen in DELCAMP forum.
http://forum.guitarsalon.com/showthread.php?t=9856
And this is not the first time I had seen.
--JT

_________________________________

G'day, mates and thank you, JT, for bringing this up. With due respect to everyone, I must admit that this is the reason why I no longer visit the forum as often as I used to. Surely some members' comments can be easily taken out of context and can lead to harsh words being exchanged... a very sad situation to say the least. Let's all try to be kind to one another, okay? Best regards.

[Great Googly Moogly]

That was a cool post, Faya :)

[Tim Miklaucic]

I will discuss with David and Dave Tate the idea of having additional moderators or "greeters" on this forum. We have long wanted to have outside contributors to the GSI site for reviews of products including CDs, Books, Videos, etc, but somehow we never did. Maybe this would be an opportunity to try the concept in the forum.

By the way, we are working on getting new posts on the front page. May take some time, but we'll get them back.

Tim

[Faya]

That was a cool post, Faya :)

Thanks Man !...........i'm glad some one understands it......:lol::wink:

[Pepe Vergara]

... We have long wanted to have outside contributors to the GSI site for reviews of products including CDs, Books, Videos, etc, but somehow we never did....
Tim
This is a great idea. I know for a fact, that every time C.F. Vega recommends something, I pay attention. I have purchased couple of guitars that he recommended once, and he was right on!. I keep those masterpieces as part of my collection. Same thing with the books. I am not alone. I know he has a crowd of followers that are waiting for him to recommend something. Like him, there are other valuable opinions that help people discover the benefits of certain product. I for example, always recommend the Aparicio AA100, and the Carmen Loriente.

[Pepe Vergara]

i thought i would add that i consider Pepe a friend !
Just so people don't think i'm trying to start trouble.

My question is an honest one Pepe.
i am very curious to why your opinion differs from Vega's on this Loriente one??
Considering the fact you hold his opinion in such high regards.

i have played many Lorientes and everyone of them seemed like a great guitar................but i'm not a luthier as you two are.............


Thanks!

Hi Nacio: If I remember correctly, CFVega was critical of the fact that originally the Loriente came with a signature of Mr. Antonio Loriente. He thought that was misleading and almost SheryBrenesque. He did not refer to the quality of the guitars. Tim himself recognized it and later and almost immediately changed his marketing focus. The truth is that the Lorientes do not need any marketing gimmick to stand out.

I purchased one guitar by Vicente Camacho by a recommendation he made at the AG forum. It turned out to be a real jewel. His style may not be the most humble, but he does not mislead anyone. I know he has a caustic humor, that is all. Knowing you well, I know that if you try the man, you will end up becoming closer to him than you were to Jube.

[brian richardson]

i remember brazilian rosewood being questioned
to the point where tim m. even offered to send one out to a certain doubter
'to be inspected', no money down. and that still wasn't good enough.

[ewok]

Look at this thread, especially the last few posts, then you will realize what's wrong.

[Pepe Vergara]

One of the key of successful communication is being able to hear what the other person is saying, not how he or she is saying it. Many times one person says something, but they mean another. We should be able to "read" what they say to avoid glitches in the communication.

Nacio, the deal about Brazilian rosewood is more than what it was written in that post. One party knew his limits, and the other was challenging the limits. It is part of the action generated and fueled by others. The truth is that no luthier or manufacturer will accept nowdays that his guitar is made with Brazilian rosewood unless they can hold a CITES certificate, and that is hard to get. I purchased two sets of BR from a luthier in Australia and the cost was high, plus additional paperwork due to the CITIES process. It came with the papers. Most will agree that they are using some kind of southamerican rosewood, or brazilian wood, or amazon rosewood, etc. So that discussion was going no where.

I remember reading about the war between Hindus (India) and muslams (Pakistan), Mahatma Ghandi (sp?) responded, when told by the muslams that the (Ley del Talion) law of eye by an eye and a tooth by a tooth, "if we follow that law", he said, " we all end up blind and toothless." There is right time to bury the hatchet, or to stop renting space in one's head to other people. Our head space is too valuable to waste it in small things.

[Libre]

I really miss the old format.
I just can't adjust - don't know why.
It's not all that different, it's the content that should be important, not the packaging.
But I still miss it.
Now it looks like every other forum, whereas before it looked like no other forum.
I'm a creature of habit - a dinosaur, I guess.
When I'm playing chess on an unfamiliar board, I usually lose - I just can't see the pieces or visualize the positions.
I have dreams about having to play the guitar, with an inappropriate guitar (tiny in size, or steel strings), or an ill fitting chair (arms interfering, or height too high or low).
And, it's happened in real life too - I never play well under those circumstances.
Once I get used to something and feel comfortable with it, I dislike it to change on me.
I can sympathize with the designers - I just spent like 300 hours to upgrade a database that I designed - one we use here at work - only to decide (actually my boss/brother decided) that we (he) likes the old version better.
Arrrrggggh!
And, another thing is, in all my posts, I think I said most of what I have to say on the topic of classical guitar, the players, and the music.
I still pop by every so often, and will continue to do so - just not as frequently or as regularly as I used to.
But, here's something I haven't said yet - really just came around to this in the last few months:
David Russell is the greatest living player - by far.
The greatest since Segovia.
He'd be the best of all time, except Segovia's magic still rules.
See ya.

[cgram@adelphia.net]

Yeah, lately there's been a lot of rehashing of old subjects, so I was thinking; maybe we've discussed everything we have to discuss. But I always have a ton of questions, more now that I'm playing so much, so I'll just post em here and see what happens.

[Great Googly Moogly]

One of the key of successful communication is being able to hear what the other person is saying, not how he or she is saying it. Many times one person says something, but they mean another. We should be able to "read" what they say to avoid glitches in the communication.

Nacio, the deal about Brazilian rosewood is more than what it was written in that post. One party knew his limits, and the other was challenging the limits. It is part of the action generated and fueled by others. The truth is that no luthier or manufacturer will accept nowdays that his guitar is made with Brazilian rosewood unless they can hold a CITES certificate, and that is hard to get. I purchased two sets of BR from a luthier in Australia and the cost was high, plus additional paperwork due to the CITIES process. It came with the papers. Most will agree that they are using some kind of southamerican rosewood, or brazilian wood, or amazon rosewood, etc. So that discussion was going no where.

I remember reading about the war between Hindus (India) and muslams (Pakistan), Mahatma Ghandi (sp?) responded, when told by the muslams that the (Ley del Talion) law of eye by an eye and a tooth by a tooth, "if we follow that law", he said, " we all end up blind and toothless." There is right time to bury the hatchet, or to stop renting space in one's head to other people. Our head space is too valuable to waste it in small things.
THAT was a fantastic post. Great wisdom, Pepe, I have to say. There's another quote by Gandhi that is my favorite of all. Too bad I can not post it here. It is off topic. :)

[Faya]

Hey Libre!!!..............Good to see you again!!:D

[Libre]

Hey Faya!
What's up, bro?
Speaking of bad dreams, your avitar is going to give me some.

[Dave Tate]

Hi guys,

Just a quick post, then you can carry on. I believe the spam issue is resolved (hopefully). Let's keep our eyes on it...

Thanks,
Dave

[sanderdude]

Hi Libre: It is good to see you posting again. I remember when my favorite forum on wooden boats, the first one I joined went through this same change. I felt a real loss for months. Gradually as I lurked my way back in I unknowingly grew used to the new one. I am sure it will work that way for you too. Just takes time. I came here looking for info on which guitar to buy, then wound up going to a luthier and learning to build a really good one and now I am actually learning to play again after a 25 year layoff. None of this would have happened without this forum and the wonderful support and advice I have gotten here.

[pek]

here you are a quick vid for those getting bored of the lack of activity.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wq0ZLCvvwsY

[brian richardson]

I really miss the old format.
I just can't adjust - don't know why.
It's not all that different, it's the content that should be important, not the packaging.
But I still miss it.
Now it looks like every other forum, whereas before it looked like no other forum.
I'm a creature of habit - a dinosaur, I guess.
When I'm playing chess on an unfamiliar board, I usually lose - I just can't see the pieces or visualize the positions.
I have dreams about having to play the guitar, with an inappropriate guitar (tiny in size, or steel strings), or an ill fitting chair (arms interfering, or height too high or low).
And, it's happened in real life too - I never play well under those circumstances.
Once I get used to something and feel comfortable with it, I dislike it to change on me.
I can sympathize with the designers - I just spent like 300 hours to upgrade a database that I designed - one we use here at work - only to decide (actually my boss/brother decided) that we (he) likes the old version better.
Arrrrggggh!
And, another thing is, in all my posts, I think I said most of what I have to say on the topic of classical guitar, the players, and the music.
I still pop by every so often, and will continue to do so - just not as frequently or as regularly as I used to.
But, here's something I haven't said yet - really just came around to this in the last few months:
David Russell is the greatest living player - by far.
The greatest since Segovia.
He'd be the best of all time, except Segovia's magic still rules.
See ya.

WOW, a blast from the past!!LOL
good seeing you back.
how's the hand??

[JoeAlders]

Hi guys,

Just a quick post, then you can carry on. I believe the spam issue is resolved (hopefully). Let's keep our eyes on it...

Thanks,
Dave

Hello Dave,

Please do not tell us what measures you took!! The only thing I hope is
that we got rid of these parasites!

Joe.

[Sandra]

Please do not tell us what measures you took!!
As someone who admins a rather large forum, I'm really curious what steps have been taken here.

But you are right, Joe. Such info should not be posted in public where the spammers can possibly see it and then try to find new ways to circumvent it.

Dave, can you send me a PM on this, pretty please? :cool:

[Libre]

WOW, a blast from the past!!LOL
good seeing you back.
how's the hand??
Hand feels better - stopped hurting at lest. Still looks bad though.
The hearing issue hasn't come back either - so I'm in a lot better shape.
Except I haven't done any serious practicing for awhile - so the season is shot as far as the MET is concerned.
I need to go over everything and practice some LH and RH and see where that gets me. I think the layoff did me some good actually.

[cgram@adelphia.net]

remember the wonders of the first villa lobos etude.

[Libre]

That's just what I had in mind.
VL1

[rdubb]

Yay! Libre! Good to hear the organic vehicle is doing better! Hope to see you around these parts.

[GSI Fan]

Hello old friends.

There's probably nothing at all wrong with the forum - just my fyi. Things change. Life changes. So smile, it's all good.

Carry on...I'll say hello again the next time I'm passing through.

[Richard]

GSI Fan, where have you been, and how is your guitar life going? Welcome back!

[brian richardson]

yo fanny!!!!!!
been a long time!!:shock:
:twisted::twisted::twisted:

[GSI Fan]

Richard, guitar life is over for me. It’s a hand thing of some sort. Aside from that, life is good.

Bri, ya’ old hump, I fell off the planet. Btw, #1 is hanging out at GSI waiting for you…LOL!!!

[brian richardson]

hey fanny,
i tried to e you and it got bounced back??!!
PM me and give me a good one.

[Jubilee Valence]

Okay, Pepe, in an effort to do my part and create some content, I've started a "show off your headstock/rosette" thread.

http://forum.guitarsalon.com/showthread.php?t=9878

Okay, Pepe, in an effort to do my part and create some content, I've started a "show off your headstock/rosette" thread.

http://forum.guitarsalon.com/showthread.php?t=9878

Well Don Pepe, in response to your most keen observation....uh...well....even if I had access to the 'net etc as was the practice in better times..

(ok, this "new" set-up's got me stymied!?)

And on top o'that....

My Sony Vaio (sic) is also a thing of the past.....(today has me on a laptop at a friend of a friend's blah blah blah...so just input'ting is somewhat of a challenge!!?)

...an' where's the dragons and the little Tres Equis guys???!!! (grrr...)
___________

Part II....

Wel'p.....I got one rosette left!!!??

Sorry to cross-report (see above for excuses..wink) but I can't participate in Catgirl's (wink) thread other than this cheap hi-jac (wink...pssst--"on topic")

But thankfully our most dignified of rosettes can be seen at [i]Pepe's Place
[normally link would be here--wink]

Also (Pepe) I did recover my recording equipment and will soon post (after I figure out HOW!!???) the initial recording of the "BlancaPrima" which has a recurring theme (sic?) bridging several modes of nylon play.....(guitar stuff!? tsk tsk!?? wink)...in wha-?? "Testimonials"???

I dunno...

Del-Camps??

Aw'right then....

Winks & Hastas all around!

Jubidubiduuu'
_________

ppssstt! Dave....did I miss the "Open House"
________

*gee...golly...no spam huh??
gosh! Now I can't tell nobody about the "_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Salsa" cd available at "blah blah-zon" that I'm throwin' in with(playin' with the group...)

gee

golly!

WINK!! ciao'
JV "Chirico"

[Jubilee Valence]

Richard, guitar life is over for me. It’s a hand thing of some sort. Aside from that, life is good.

Bri, ya’ old hump, I fell off the planet. Btw, #1 is hanging out at GSI waiting for you…LOL!!!

HEY RED!!!!!

(if ya' aint heard....the guys'll haf'ta catch yas' up...tuff guy....)

WINK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Richard]

Well we've had two treats on this thread: the return of GSI Fan and now Jubilee Vance. GSI Fan gave us an update, how about you Jubi? Did you recover your guitars?

[Jubilee Valence]

Hey Richard! Sad to note (as inferred in "Part II" above..wink!) that "no"...

everything is gone...

except por mi 1A Blanca....

the clothes on my back...

& a beat-up pick-'em-up truck courtesy of a buddy in Casa Grande!

Ahhhhhh!!!??
--such is the life of a true musician, no?

So what's up with treat'sy weet'sy #1???? ('fanny)

[on topic---I'm still struggling with this pagino-nuevo business!]

cheers!

JV

[condeclaro]

I am reading over at AG and there seems to be a cool core group of people who actually enjoy each others company and just like hanging out, chatting and sharing thoughts on topics from the mundane to the more interesting. It is a small group but they don’t mind posting frequently. At least there seems a to be an identifiable community.

Maybe its just me, but lately this forum seems like its just people stopping in on there way to delcamp or AG, or people checking in once a month, and is easily overun by people who could care less. I see, a general lack of identity or waiting for some past identity to return. Everyone seems reluctant to post, or bored of tedius diatribes (haha, my bad :() Don’t know if anyone even likes one another.


Have a great 3-day weekend everyone!

[nylon6]

Yeah, it's rather ironic that GSI went to all the trouble to update the forum, then it died! There are several knowledgeable people and excellent players around here...let's try to keep it alive.

[Michelob]

Well… maybe I should apologize for bringing back some ghosts from the past (!) waiting –as Condeclaro insightfully puts it- “for some past identity to return”. When I joined last year, at about this time (was it?) I remember how much I enjoyed interacting with other Guitar players, from every walk of life and part of the world. Just reading all that wealth of combined experience, and knowledge… diatribes notwithstanding, and the occasional misunderstanding, this Forum “rocked”. There are indeed, as Nylon6 proclaims, very good players and knowledgeable people on this Forum. From the ever lucid, fair minded Dave, to the “guru” of guitar making Don Pepe, there are in between brilliant writers with questions and answers, doubts and challenges, worth reviving.
Please contribute, y’all out there… let’s bring this Forum back, and make GSI whole of this fantastic effort it made for us all.

[Richard]

I disagree with the premise of this thread. Recently, there have been more posts here, and most of them substantive, than at any of the other CG forums. Sure there was a lull during the software transition, but that's now months behind us.

[Todd]

not to dis Michelob (you're my bud Mich!), but yeah, i was thinking things were rolling pretty well
actually.
But hey, it can always be better.

Lets take it up a notch people!!!! :) LOL
TK

[Michelob]

Dear Todd you could never dis me, or anyone, but thank you for the thoughtful disclaimer (along with the “Michelob is my Bud” line… you got quite a catchy ad should the two brewers ever merge). I was just responding to Condeclaro and Nylon6’s calls for reviving the Forum.

Once David Collett mentioned how interesting it would be to organize a gathering of the Forum’s members and see their (our) interaction in person. Not an easy one, but not a bad idea either.

On a separate note Todd, if I can, and by no means want to give you the misperception that I want to exploit our fellowship to this Forum, I meant to ask you about Recording music. I understand you too are in NYC. I am fine-tuning a set of serenades for voice and flamenco guitar. Which I intend to submit to a few important performers out there. This latter part, I can do through the connection I make in my practice. However, as to recording, since I am not a pro, what would you suggest? I have about 10 pieces that I would like to record and I fancy it will take me at least 8 hours for each –I am not exactly the most flawless performer I am afraid, and recording is unforgiving of the slightest imperfection. However, I only want to put together a “demo” –I guess- . I have an 8 track digital recording eq. at home with a couple of nice mics. What do you do for Demo stuff…Home recording? Or do you need pro tool and similar programmes and gadgets, more tracks than 8…? I will be grateful for any suggestion you may find the time to spare.
Dearly

[Todd]

Hi Mich,

Yeah, 8 track digital would be plenty for a voice and a few guitar tracks.
You dont need full blown software or anything.

I have to get ready for a gig tonite, but feel free to email me tomorrow,
and i'll give you as much info as i can.
toddkreuz@gmail.com
Oh btw, im in Maryland, not NYC. Only a 2 or 3 hour drive though.:)

[Michelob]

Thank you Todd, I will e-mail you separately on this, perhaps later we should start a thread on this as i am sure many members enjoy recording their performance, and i am told you are "it" when it comes to storing sound electronically.

[Richard]

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that this forum is far and away the most active of the CG blogs? I know there was a lull when Pepe started this thread, but I believe the activity here now is about triple the level of Delcamp or AG. It's been a lot of fun!

[Jubilee Valence]

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that this forum is far and away the most active of the CG blogs? I know there was a lull when Pepe started this thread, but I believe the activity here now is about triple the level of Delcamp or AG. It's been a lot of fun!

triple the level of Delcamp or AG.

triple the level of Delcamp or AG.

triple the level of Delcamp or AG.

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Richard, You're truly a "shrewd" and most reliable observer!!!!

Welcome, btw!!!!!

Yep! The GREATEST!!!! When I first got here I was just overwhelmed by the store itself along with it's staff, and the forum with all it's info & all the great members1

(pssstt! And now--EVERYBODY can *thank Brian & Faya for welcoming me during the **Jimi Hendrix [**-in a CG site!!!??-JV] thread...right after they realized---
Ya' just got'ta read 'em out loud!!!)

Jubi

*A-A-AHEM....not too sure if "thank" is the "right term..."--hhmmnnnn???

HAAA!!!---Boys, 'yer----"BUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!"

[rdubb]

thank god for GSI. Even though i'm lurkin hard now, i still come back here. Delcamp is a total joke, overmoderated to the extreme and chock full of people that spend most of their waking hours rubbing each others back. Never tried AG, probably a waste of time as well.

[Todd]

thank god for GSI. Even though i'm lurkin hard now, i still come back here. Delcamp is a total joke, overmoderated to the extreme and chock full of people that spend most of their waking hours rubbing each others back. Never tried AG, probably a waste of time as well.

Totally. And that whole "Owl" story.. Good grief, what a mess.
She's such a genius player, and they tried as hard as they could
to just f'ing bury her. (for what ended up being a whole lotta nothing)

Its pretty sad.

Yeah, AG sucks ass. :)

TK

[sausgirl]

Hola amigos e amigas!
I read the post and I am very happy Pepe started it.
It is difficult to change and I have found the new format hard to use.
But I never claimed to know how to use a computer,or play classical guitar!
I come in about twice a week-it is good to see you all.
The only person I haven't seen here is Pedro.Is he OK.
Love to all my brothers and friends,
Jan

[Guitar Slim]

You know, one of the things that bothers me about both forums is the adolescent level of high-school cliquishness -- either you're in or you're out, either you're for us or against us, etc.

I saw it a couple of weeks ago at Delcamp, where a group of "outsiders" jumped at the first chance to savage one of the most popular "insiders" on the forum. On the other side, I saw a whole bunch of "insiders" who were willing to thow integrity and ethics out the window just to hush up something embarassing and protect their own image -- despite the allgedly strict ethical policies of the site.

And I see it here too, with all of this GSI vs. Delcamp sniping.

I believe the activity here now is about triple the level of Delcamp or AG. It's been a lot of fun!

Look, you can prefer GSI over Delcamp -- I'm disaffected with Delcamp myself at the moment -- but what is this? Cheerleading? Propaganda? Clearly there's more activity at Delcamp in a single morning that there at GSI in an entire week -- it's been that way for as long as I've been a member of either forum. What's the point of lying about it?

It just all seems very childish to me sometimes.

Fair warning, I intend to continue to annoy the members of both forums, without declaring my allegiance to either.

[Richard]

Originally posted by Guitar Slim
You know, one of the things that bothers me about both forums is the adolescent level of high-school cliquishness -- either you're in or you're out, either you're for us or against us, etc.
I saw it a couple of weeks ago at Delcamp, where a group of "outsiders" jumped at the first chance to savage one of the most popular "insiders" on the forum. On the other side, I saw a whole bunch of "insiders" who were willing to thow integrity and ethics out the window just to hush up something embarassing and protect their own image -- despite the allgedly strict ethical policies of the site.
And I see it here too, with all of this GSI vs. Delcamp sniping.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard
I believe the activity here now is about triple the level of Delcamp or AG. It's been a lot of fun!
Look, you can prefer GSI over Delcamp -- I'm disaffected with Delcamp myself at the moment -- but what is this? Cheerleading? Propaganda? Clearly there's more activity at Delcamp in a single morning that there at GSI in an entire week -- it's been that way for as long as I've been a member of either forum. What's the point of lying about it?
It just all seems very childish to me sometimes.

Guitar Slim, I was simply responding to the subject matter of this thread, "What is wrong with the forum," and I legitimately noted the recent activity level. It's not cheerleading or propaganda. Meanwhile, we may disagree on the post counts, but I'm not going to go back and do a tally to prove you wrong. Otherwise, I enjoy your posts!

[Guitar Slim]

Guitar Slim, I was simply responding to the subject matter of this thread, "What is wrong with the forum," and I legitimately noted the recent activity level. It's not cheerleading or propaganda. Meanwhile, we may disagree on the post counts, but I'm not going to go back and do a tally to prove you wrong. Otherwise, I enjoy your posts!

I agree that the activity at GSI has improved recently, as well as the level of discourse. But my own impression is pretty much the opposite of yours -- that the activity level at Delcamp remains three times the level of activity at GSI.

But like you I'm not inclined to waste time counting posts or compiling stats just to score a point. So let us agree to disagree. Cordially. Like grownups. ;)

[Michelob]

It may seem Parochial and sort of Insular, to show enthusiasm towards the club one subscribes to, but it is a manifestation of warm and true affection which some members are revealing through their posts. After all, this Forum had its fall after it had been “improved” and now it is undergoing a lively rise. It is more than natural to express a sentiment of satisfaction, while witnessing the increased level of activity. We all have a childish side, and a degree of camaraderie in our contribution. Quite a healthy approach, considering we dedicate time to this speechless screen, writing our thoughts for the unknown to hear and our fellows to share, as if speaking to ourselves from the balcony of a modest hotel.
I think your reproach was a notch too intense, Guitar Slim. Particularly so as it was directed to a specific member, who simply moved a spirited observation marking the welfare of the Forum of his predilection. Also, this Forum is associated with a store many of us love or use, and reverberates of the good experience we had or the good-will GSI promotes. A fine reason to be a bit partial towards it as well.
I too –like Richard- am fond of your postings, and found this challenge unbecoming of your style.
Dearly,

[iberianwolf]

The "adolescent cliquishness" is a definite turnoff. It's often more like some silly teenage chat room than a classical/flamenco guitar forum around here.

And then there's the occasional little quip like Todd K's childish "AG sucks a**." comment. What can one say?

[Todd]

The "adolescent cliquishness" is a definite turnoff. It's often more like some silly teenage chat room than a classical/flamenco guitar forum around here.

And then there's the occasional little quip like Todd K's childish "AG sucks a**." comment. What can one say?

Ok, how about this. AG is boring.. Better??

[Guitar Slim]

It may seem Parochial and sort of Insular, to show enthusiasm towards the club one subscribes to, but it is a manifestation of warm and true affection which some members are revealing through their posts.

Hmm...I guess my problem is, I subscribe to both "clubs" and find no reason at all for them to be mutually exclusive. They are both excellent forums. Each provides resources and services that the other cannot. Each has a different focus and a different character.

The two forums are not a pair of rival high schools or rival sports teams, and I am not inclined to treat them as such. Nor do I feel that bashing other guitarists who are arbitrarily seen as "rivals" because of their association with a different group is particularly healthy -- or mature.

And I have to add, the GSI forum is not even a blip on the radar over at Delcamp -- I don't think I've ever seen it mentioned. GSI's business, however, is mentioned often and is very highly regarded.

[Sasquatch51]

I saw it a couple of weeks ago at Delcamp, where a group of "outsiders" jumped at the first chance to savage one of the most popular "insiders" on the forum.

Wow. That's just about as far from the truth as it gets. You can't be expected to know everything that was going on, but you CAN be expected not to go to other forums and make accusatory statements without knowing the facts..but, whatever....that was on another forum. It's pretty much a moot point now anyway.

[PedroO]

... but you CAN be expected not to go to other forums and make accusatory statements without knowing the facts.... ...... It's pretty much a moot point now anyway.

I seldom go to other forums. However, this sounds interesting. I would like to know what happened. Regarding being a moot point, it is like saying SHUT UP. And believe me, I hate to shut up. It is when my right to speak comes alive. Mr. Guitarslim, please go ahead and tell us the story. If you prefer, leave the names out. What happened?

[PedroO]

.... a store many of us love or use ...

I would suggest, you speak for yourself! :)

[Sasquatch51]

I seldom go to other forums. However, this sounds interesting. I would like to know what happened. Regarding being a moot point, it is like saying SHUT UP. And believe me, I hate to shut up. It is when my right to speak comes alive. Mr. Guitarslim, please go ahead and tell us the story. If you prefer, leave the names out. What happened?

Well, it's actually not anything at all like saying "shut up". See, THAT'S putting words in my mouth. What it means is exactly what it said...it's a moot point (in case you have trouble understanding that, I'll define it for you if you wish...just ask). It's done and over. The guilty party resigned and there is no reason to continue beating that horse...it's dead. It has nothing at all to do with this forum, but if you want to waste GSI bandwidth gossiping about what happened at Delcamp's forum, feel free.

[Dave Tate]

I would suggest, you speak for yourself! :)

:confused:

[Michelob]

On the eve of the Roman troops annihilating the sworn and untamed enemy of Rome, Carthage, Scipio –the African as they called him- wrote in his diary:
“we are about to destroy what keeps Rome together, its enemy”.

It seems that Bellucci kept the pack focused, and now that we quit crucifying the Maestro, we are all on our own again, stimulating petty accusations against one another(?) that is sad.... really...

[Sasquatch51]

On the eve of the Roman troops annihilating the sworn and untamed enemy of Rome, Carthage, Scipio –the African as they called him- wrote in his diary:
“we are about to destroy what keeps Rome together, its enemy”.

It seems that Bellucci kept the pack focused, and now that we quit crucifying the Maestro, we are all on our own again, stimulating petty accusations against one another(?) that is sad.... really...

It certainly is.......

[Guitar Slim]

Fair warning, I intend to continue to annoy the members of both forums, without declaring my allegiance to either.

Damn I'm good!

[Faya]

Ok, how about this. AG is boring.. Better??

LOLLOL!!!!!!!!!!!...........good one dude!!!!!!!!!!:lol::lol::lol::lol

man.............they all have there good and bad points............but i always seem to have more fun here!

but i'm one of the "adolescents" or more technically known as "PKH" people..........;)

[Faya]

Damn I'm good!

LOL!!!.............dude!!!.............you are the most level headed guy i've ever seen on these forums HANDS DOWN!!!!(period)

[brian richardson]

LOLLOL!!!!!!!!!!!...........good one dude!!!!!!!!!!:lol

man.............they all have there good and bad points............but i always seem to have more fun here!

but i'm one of the "adolescents" or more technically known as "PKH" people..........;)

you rang??

[Faya]

[/b]

you rang??

nope..............but this is a typical response from a sufferer of someone who has "PKH Syndrome"............!!!

as the President and Co-Founder of the "PKH Foundation"...........i advise you to refer to the Japanese web pages for support immediately !!!!

You are setting a bad example as the "Vice President" and fellow "Co-Founder"!!

[PedroO]

:confused:

So your are there? :0

What happened to the open house at GSI?

[Jubilee Valence]

nope..............but this is a typical response from a sufferer of someone who has "PKH Syndrome"............!!!

as the President and Co-Founder of the "PKH Foundation"...........i advise you to refer to the Japanese web pages for support immediately !!!!

You are setting a bad example as the "Vice President" and fellow "Co-Founder"!!

HEY!!!

DON'T FER'GET YER' #1 CHARTER MEMBER!!!!!???

So your are there? :0

What happened to the open house at GSI?

...YEAH!!!!!!!

...WHAT HE SAID!!!!!!!!!!??????????

[brian richardson]

nope..............but this is a typical response from a sufferer of someone who has "PKH Syndrome"............!!!

as the President and Co-Founder of the "PKH Foundation"...........i advise you to refer to the Japanese web pages for support immediately !!!!

You are setting a bad example as the "Vice President" and fellow "Co-Founder"!!

sorry, i'll try to take my office and position
more seriously in the future.
honestly, i thought i WAS living up to the base
standards as written in the foundations charter.
then again, wha-duh-ya expect from a PKH??

BTW-she certainly has an excellent "work ethic"!!!

[Faya]

sorry, i'll try to take my office and position
more seriously in the future.
honestly, i thought i WAS living up to the base
standards as written in the foundations charter.
then again, wha-duh-ya expect from a PKH??

BTW-she certainly has an excellent "work ethic"!!!

LOLLOL!!............very good work ethic! indeed!........LOL!
you are rightly acting so............my fellow!!
i was just trying to get you to visit the Headquarters "website".......wink wink!!

Hello fellow charter member Jubi!!..............why don't you have brother Brian send you the first edition of our monthly news letter and read over some of the tips for how to stay "PKH Outbreak Free"...........i'm sure you will find them help full..............LOL!

[Jubilee Valence]

.....the first edition of our monthly news letter and read over.....blah blah....blah....

psst! Monro', & ET,....I thing maybe we missed the Open House, huh?

??????????

[Faya]

psst! Monro', & ET,....I thing maybe we missed the Open House, huh?

??????????

who cares!!!!!!!!!..........lololololol!!!!!!

[Faya]

.........oh yeah...............to stay on topic of this thread and it's title.

"ME!"